Original and Knock off

by Volker Weber


Original: Stackoverflow.com

Knock off

Knock off: Elenchus


the big question is, what will IBM do? They generally take a very dim view of copyright violation, even if it's not an IBM copyright.

Bob Balaban, 2009-07-27

Maybe it is just me, but I can't see why IBM would care, or even how this is a copyright violation. Look and Feel lawsuits are tough to win, and tougher with a website that honestly isn't terribly unique in its appearance, but even then, it isn't a copyright violation to make a solution that is like another solution. It is impressive to do it in seven hours, that's for certain.

I'm not entirely sure from your title, Volker, whether you are criticizing this or just commenting. Many open source projects are copied from popular existing products, and you've usually seemed fairly supportive of that, so is this different, or are we differing on the implication of the word "knockoff", which seems pejorative here?

Ben Langhinrichs, 2009-07-27

Awesome. Very cool that Tim was able to code up that application so easily in Domino, especially as a first project. I love the name as well. Does not roll off the tongue at first, but it is perfect for the application. Excellent that he also shared the code.

Alan Lepofsky, 2009-07-27

Ben, I think Bob's talking about IBM in the context of their involvement with OpenNTF and you know, this whole intellectual property thing...

Ben Poole, 2009-07-27

@BenL - Lotus famously won a "look'n'feel" copyright infringement case against Borland, resulting in a $100million "cachectomy" (Jim Manzi's term at the time). The case established that copyright applies to the way a software application looks and works.

I would speculate (I have no actual evicence) that IBM might not be happy that OpenNTF (of which IBM is a sponsor) could be involved in copyright infringement.

I'm just saying...

Bob Balaban, 2009-07-27

Ben, there is quite a difference between being inspired and outright theft. Q&A with kharma voting is a great idea worth further development.

Alan, I guess you are just pretending to know nothing about IP. ;-)

What I find weird is that the screenshot captures the usual suspects of the IP and licensing debate around OpenNTF. Cover-up operations are underway though and the application has been bombed back into ugly mode.

Hand no longer in cookie jar, so to say.

Volker Weber, 2009-07-27

Your post (images and text) mentioned nothing about IP, IBM lawyers, OpenNTF, and the other things people seem to be discussing in the comments. For me, your post brought attention to a cool Domino app, a great example of what X-Pages can do, and how quickly the developer was able to code it. Otherwise I would not have known about it, so thank you for posting. As for the other stuff, it does not interest me in the least. I'll leave it to others to discuss the law, cover-ups, politics over this person and that, etc. I don't have the time or energy for that stuff.

Alan Lepofsky, 2009-07-27

Fair enough, Alan. So you are not pretending. ;-)

Volker Weber, 2009-07-27

Questions, Answers, Tagging, Voting...

Looks like this: http://elguji.com/iqjam.html

Karsten Lehmann, 2009-07-27

Strange coincidence, isn't it?

Volker Weber, 2009-07-27

Maybe it shouldn't be posted on OpenNTF, but it's still a nice demonstration of how fast web development is, now that XPages are here.

To me, that's the whole point of this application.

Benoit Dubuc, 2009-07-27

REG: Right. You're in. Listen. The only people we hate more than the Romans are the flippin' Judean People's Front.

P.F.J.: Yeah...

JUDITH: Splitters.

P.F.J.: Splitters...

FRANCIS: And the Judean Popular People's Front.

P.F.J.: Yeah. Oh, yeah. Splitters. Splitters...

LORETTA: And the People's Front of Judea.

P.F.J.: Yeah. Splitters. Splitters...

REG: What?

LORETTA: The People's Front of Judea. Splitters.

REG: We're the People's Front of Judea!

LORETTA: Oh. I thought we were the Popular Front.

Craig Wiseman, 2009-07-27

It reminds me of this piece about recreating Stack Overflow :

Gaston Annebicque, 2009-07-27

Benoit, they are still sorting through all the pieces which have been misappropriated.

Volker Weber, 2009-07-27

@Bob if I remember rightly, that Borland case was lost by Lotus on appeal. Thereby freeing up the world to copy menus, look etc.

carl tyler, 2009-07-28

Of course, the stupid part is acting like you can copy the general look and that you have really created an application. Whereas IQJam will have been carefully designed and handle lots of situations people don't even realize they have to anticipate, this is most likely just another OpenSource me-too application that will die on the vine. I love that xpages lets you create the shell of an application so easily, but don't want my excitement over that to be confused for thinking Tim's app is really anything more than demoware. I could be wrong, but...

Ben Langhinrichs, 2009-07-28

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