What is declining?

by Volker Weber

Ed Brill says:

use of POP/IMAP is declining dramatically in the consumer space

It's only what all the iPhones and Androids use, or the iPads, I mean unless they use Microsoft Exchange ActiveSync. It's what the Mac uses when the user sets it up, unless the Mac is talking to an Exchange Server. It's what Ubuntu configures in Evolution, unless ... you get the drift. Ah, yes, I forgot, Windows 7 as well.

You would not want to try that in Notes. POP/IMAP in Notes and Domino are stuck in the last century. They only serve as proof for being "open" and "standards based". But then again, who is going to try that anyway, now that you can talk to a Domino server with Microsoft Exchange ActiveSync?


Guess that's why on the LotusLive web site for iNotes they promote it as Essential to webmail. https://www.lotuslive.com/en/services/inotes

Bill Dorge, 2010-05-01

And don't forget what Lotus Foundations provides for every single user. Maybe the build it in because no one will use it?!

Thomas Lang, 2010-05-01

Notes/Domino is meant to be used in a non-consumer space - right?.
None of my consumer friends use Notes (unfortunately ;-)
Professional use of POP3 is probably declining, but my impression is that IMAP is strong. Ergo: Notes/Domino should have a strong IMAP implementation. Unfortunately is has not (yet).
I would like to see a rock solid and easy to use IMAP client and server implementation in Notes/Domino. Despite the fact that this might make it easier to migrate away from the platform, it could also open it up for new customers that might benefit from the fact that N/D is not only mail and calendaring, but a rapid application development platform.

Uwe Brahm, 2010-05-01

Oh the irony of seeing IBM Lotus product support of POP/IMAP as evidence that POP/IMAP is important in the consumer space.

Forrester Research last year said over 70% of Internet users used a web-based mail service (e.g. Gmail, yahoo, hotmail, comcast.net, etc). Yes most of those support POP and/or IMAP, but use of these protocols for primary end-user personal desktop email is indeed declining rapidly. Mobile devices accessing those same web-based services may use an installed client and one of those protocols.

For an installed desktop, where Notes as a POP/IMAP client could play, I'll stick with my position. Yes OS vendors still ship such a client and Thunderbird is still out there, but the usage is declining in favor of consumer webmail.

Ed Brill, 2010-05-01

seeing IBM Lotus product support of POP/IMAP as evidence that POP/IMAP is important

Where do you see that?

Volker Weber, 2010-05-01

the first two comments.

Ed Brill, 2010-05-01

Ed, I'm just agreeing with Volker that I don't think it's on decline. In fact, correct me if I'm wrong, but the only other way to access LotusLive iNotes besides a browser is POP/IMAP and authenticated SMTP.

It's alright, for most of my customers, this is great product, all the features they need and the price is right.

Bill Dorge, 2010-05-01

More people seem to be using the browser as the primary means to access e-mail. I know that I barely fire up an e-mail client any more. Since I moved my mail to hosted gmail, I interact almost entirely with my Blackberry and a web browser.

Perhaps this was the intent?

Eric Hancock, 2010-05-01

Yes, that was the intent.

Volker Weber, 2010-05-01

A lot of webmail frontends use IMAP in the backend. Maybe not true for gmail, but there are (still) some other places.

Stefan Funke, 2010-05-01

Bill, my comment is solely directed at the consumer/individual/personal side of the email market, the place where people say that giving away Notes for free would translate to increased mindshare. In that segment, the vast majority use (and prefer to use) browsers and perhaps their mobile devices. I can't see how giving away Notes to use as a personal email client would have any real impact.

As I said on my own blog on this topic, I am interested in individual use of Notes. I don't think email is the best way to do it.

Ed Brill, 2010-05-01

Re: individual use of Notes.

I think the Notes platform won't see consumer-level use until there's a paradigm shift in the idea of what applications can be developed *for* the platform.

Give the users a *reason* to run Notes as a consumer app by giving them social networking apps, content import and export apps that integrate with their productivity suite (which, with Symphony...).

Email will be an afterthought, since that's not how the majority of the younger consumers communicate today. Where email is needed (by 31 yr old relics like me who still use it), the more options available the better: POP, IMAP, NRPC/Domino-based Messaging, a GMail reader app, etc.

All of this is possible in the product as it exists today from a development standpoint -- it is up to us however, those developers who write solutions for the platform to understand just what is possible and work along side the vendor to make it happen.

Chris Toohey, 2010-05-02

POP3/IMAP are unsuitable to support calendaring and scheduling, so they don't seem to be a good fit for enterprise messaging (getting time management right is one of the frontiers of enterprise efficiency). So a lack of focus on these protocols seems logical.
Market reality however, especially in growth markets might paint a different picture where POP3/IMAP are seen as the least common denominator for environments where online access is hampered by slow and/or unreliable networks (GSM would qualify as both).
Just check the speed of online access in India, China or Indonesia outside a few city bright spots.

Stephan H. Wissel, 2010-05-02

As Lotus has learned meanwhile, there are pretty good ways to exchange calendar information outside of "enterprise" proprietary systems. and betting on the demise of IMAP seems risky to me. Together with LDAP, it is the foundation of open systems.

It does not matter which current operating system you install, you will be asked to provide your email address, and then you will be set up using IMAP.

Volker Weber, 2010-05-02

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